turn8
Full Member
Pretty well effed up.
Posts: 219
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Post by turn8 on Jun 20, 2021 8:16:42 GMT -8
Nice. That was a nice shot of Max blowing right through the clag without seemingly losing any grip. Great passđź‘Ť
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Post by Red_Hercules on Jun 20, 2021 8:38:25 GMT -8
Bravo Max.
Any race where Lulu and mercedes don't win is a "good race".
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Post by Pistola on Jun 20, 2021 8:51:57 GMT -8
My hatred of RB is awake and throbbing.
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Post by snuffmoviestar on Jun 20, 2021 9:05:11 GMT -8
My hatred of RB is awake and throbbing. I hate or ignore pretty everyone except for Ferrari but I was standing and screaming when Max got past Lewis at the end.  |
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Post by pushtopass on Jun 20, 2021 9:27:18 GMT -8
My hatred of RB is awake and throbbing. I hate or ignore pretty everyone except for Ferrari but I was standing and screaming when Max got past Lewis at the end. It was cool but less exciting than I had hoped. It was more along the lines of what Merc used to do to everyone else; just power by on the straight and no need for dramatic braking. Kept things exciting, though! Heckuva drive from Russell today, too. |
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Post by pushtopass on Jun 20, 2021 9:45:21 GMT -8
Bottas whining about how a two-stop strategy was the right approach today, neglecting the fact that he was passed by Perez who was also on a one-stop strategy. Perhaps he could have been ahead with two stops, but the point was that executing the one-stop strategy properly was as much the key as anything.
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Post by Pistola on Jun 20, 2021 10:01:18 GMT -8
Amidst all the groveling it's worth remembering nobody but Merc and RB has won a championship since 2010 2009.
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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Jun 20, 2021 10:09:41 GMT -8
Bottas whining about how a two-stop strategy was the right approach today, neglecting the fact that he was passed by Perez who was also on a one-stop strategy. Perhaps he could have been ahead with two stops, but the point was that executing the one-stop strategy properly was as much the key as anything. Bottas was correct. Perez's result on a one stop means nothing in that regard. |
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Post by pushtopass on Jun 20, 2021 10:49:01 GMT -8
tough to say. Max was ahead of Lewis, pitted, then ended up ahead of Lewis by about the same amount as when he ducked into the pits for his second stop. He had run almost the entire stint on hard tires in clean air so I don't know why one would have expected Lewis to have been able to pass him given the RB straight-line speed advantage. Perez passed Bottas, both on one-stops. It seems that execution as as important or even more than the number of pit stops.
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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Jun 20, 2021 11:12:34 GMT -8
tough to say. Max was ahead of Lewis, pitted, then ended up ahead of Lewis by about the same amount as when he ducked into the pits for his second stop. He had run almost the entire stint on hard tires in clean air so I don't know why one would have expected Lewis to have been able to pass him given the RB straight-line speed advantage. Perez passed Bottas, both on one-stops. It seems that execution as as important or even more than the number of pit stops. None of what you have written makes any sense nor is it what happened in the race. Bottas had the pace to stay with Verstappen and Hamilton. He was racing for the win. Perez by the first pitstop had fallen to almost 10 seconds behind the lead three. He was not racing for the win. He was racing to sneak his way onto the podium if Mercedes screwed up their strategy.
Early in the first stint Bottas came on the radio and said they should go to a two stop because the tires were not going to last as long as projected. He was correct. Mercedes should've at least split their drivers and put one of them on a two stop shadowing Max. Lewis said the same thing in post race interview. Mercedes management apologized to both drivers for screwing up. Bottas isn't whining when he is correct. |
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Post by pushtopass on Jun 20, 2021 11:23:53 GMT -8
But only if executed properly. Would the outcome have changed if Bottas stopped again? Could he have passed Perez? That is not clear at all. Would the outcome have changed if Hamilton stopped again? Could he have passed Max if he had stopped again? Under what scenario does that work? Pit before Max and try for an undercut? Would they have pitted earlier than Max did anyway? That is not clear at all. Strategies work relative to what others are doing. Neither Merc was able to pass either RB on track except when Max blew turn 1. With RBs straight-line speed I don't see it happening unless Merc REALLY gambled and did an early stop for mediums after the short stint on hards. After 20 laps on mediums Max pitted after only 12 on hards. I just don't see Merc getting past RB today. Maybe you do. And certainly with no one else on the track then two stops probably made for a faster overall time but there were other cars on the track (for instance, if Hamilton had stopped for mediums after Max do you think his two-stop race would have resulted in a win? Execution, not necessarily how many stops).
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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Jun 20, 2021 11:33:04 GMT -8
But only if executed properly. Would the outcome have changed if Bottas stopped again? Could he have passed Perez? That is not clear at all. Would the outcome have changed if Hamilton stopped again? Could he have passed Max if he had stopped again? Under what scenario does that work? Pit before Max and try for an undercut? Would they have pitted earlier than Max did anyway? That is not clear at all. Strategies work relative to what others are doing. Neither Merc was able to pass either RB on track except when Max blew turn 1. With RBs straight-line speed I don't see it happening unless Merc REALLY gambled and did an early stop for mediums after the short stint on hards. After 20 laps on mediums Max pitted after only 12 on hards. I just don't see Merc getting past RB today. Maybe you do. And certainly with no one else on the track then two stops probably made for a faster overall time but there were other cars on the track (for instance, if Hamilton had stopped for mediums after Max do you think his two-stop race would have resulted in a win? Execution, not necessarily how many stops). You are talking nonsense and and hypotheticals. Perez was never in the mix to take the win. Bottas, Hamilton and Verstappen were.
Mercedes should've at least split the strategies between the two cars on the second pit stop. One of them should have followed Max into the pits for a second pitstop allowing one Mercedes driver to see if they could make it on a one stop while the other could've stayed on Max's tail and harassed him as he was attempting to reel the leader in. Mercedes know they totally screwed it up and apologized. It is really that simple. Perez's results have nothing to do with it. He was never in the mix for the win. He lucked his way into a podium because Mercedes hung both their drivers out to dry on miscalculated one stops.
Bottas was correct and this whole thing proves what I saying about the teams hardly ever listen to what the drivers say. The engineers always rely on their data first and foremost.
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Post by Pistola on Jun 20, 2021 11:39:16 GMT -8
My hatred of RB is awake and throbbing. I hate or ignore pretty everyone except for Ferrari but I was standing and screaming when Max got past Lewis at the end.  I still hate RB...................................Max....meh. |
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Post by pushtopass on Jun 20, 2021 12:45:30 GMT -8
But only if executed properly. Would the outcome have changed if Bottas stopped again? Could he have passed Perez? That is not clear at all. Would the outcome have changed if Hamilton stopped again? Could he have passed Max if he had stopped again? Under what scenario does that work? Pit before Max and try for an undercut? Would they have pitted earlier than Max did anyway? That is not clear at all. Strategies work relative to what others are doing. Neither Merc was able to pass either RB on track except when Max blew turn 1. With RBs straight-line speed I don't see it happening unless Merc REALLY gambled and did an early stop for mediums after the short stint on hards. After 20 laps on mediums Max pitted after only 12 on hards. I just don't see Merc getting past RB today. Maybe you do. And certainly with no one else on the track then two stops probably made for a faster overall time but there were other cars on the track (for instance, if Hamilton had stopped for mediums after Max do you think his two-stop race would have resulted in a win? Execution, not necessarily how many stops). You are talking nonsense and and hypotheticals. Perez was never in the mix to take the win. Bottas, Hamilton and Verstappen were.
Mercedes should've at least split the strategies between the two cars on the second pit stop. One of them should have followed Max into the pits for a second pitstop allowing one Mercedes driver to see if they could make it on a one stop while the other could've stayed on Max's tail and harassed him as he was attempting to reel the leader in. Mercedes know they totally screwed it up and apologized. It is really that simple. Perez's results have nothing to do with it. He was never in the mix for the win. He lucked his way into a podium because Mercedes hung both their drivers out to dry on miscalculated one stops.
Bottas was correct and this whole thing proves what I saying about the teams hardly ever listen to what the drivers say. The engineers always rely on their data first and foremost.
I am not surprised the engineers don't listen to the drivers because, as we know, they have so little impact. Again, the strategy was powerful if you could make it work. I agree that they could have split strategies, but if Lewis would have pitted before Max he cannot do a hotter in lap because he is behind Max and limited somewhat, and he would have entered behind Perez and that would have been an added barrier (Perez was no barrier for Max, of course; he let him straight through). If they would have pitted Lewis very early it might have worked for sure, but I still don't see how Merc passes RB on the track today. With equivalent hards they were not able to. And it would have been viewed as VERY early, having to make the mediums last longer than they had in the first stint (albeit with lower fuel loads). If not for the superior straight line speed of the RBs I don't know that Max would have gotten past Lewis with tires that were fresher than what Lewis would have had. Again, strategies work relative to what others are doing. Where you are on the leaderboard and track at the time you implement them. It worked for RB, barely, and a one-stop for RB probably would have worked as well. Honestly we all know Bottas never was going to win so they probably should have done the Perez strategy once Bottas was on hards and behind Lewis; have him slow down and save his tires. No one other than Perez was ever going to threaten him. Do you think Lewis would have passed Max on hards if both RB cars did one-stoppers? |
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Post by snuffmoviestar on Jun 20, 2021 12:50:46 GMT -8
I hate or ignore pretty everyone except for Ferrari but I was standing and screaming when Max got past Lewis at the end. I still hate RB...................................Max....meh. Oh I hate RB and Max as well. I guess it was Lewis being passed on track by anyone and the anticipation of the Island slop eaters excuses that got me all worked up.  |
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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Jun 20, 2021 13:14:04 GMT -8
You are talking nonsense and and hypotheticals. Perez was never in the mix to take the win. Bottas, Hamilton and Verstappen were.
Mercedes should've at least split the strategies between the two cars on the second pit stop. One of them should have followed Max into the pits for a second pitstop allowing one Mercedes driver to see if they could make it on a one stop while the other could've stayed on Max's tail and harassed him as he was attempting to reel the leader in. Mercedes know they totally screwed it up and apologized. It is really that simple. Perez's results have nothing to do with it. He was never in the mix for the win. He lucked his way into a podium because Mercedes hung both their drivers out to dry on miscalculated one stops.
Bottas was correct and this whole thing proves what I saying about the teams hardly ever listen to what the drivers say. The engineers always rely on their data first and foremost.
I am not surprised the engineers don't listen to the drivers because, as we know, they have so little impact. Again, the strategy was powerful if you could make it work. I agree that they could have split strategies, but if Lewis would have pitted before Max he cannot do a hotter in lap because he is behind Max and limited somewhat, and he would have entered behind Perez and that would have been an added barrier (Perez was no barrier for Max, of course; he let him straight through). If they would have pitted Lewis very early it might have worked for sure, but I still don't see how Merc passes RB on the track today. With equivalent hards they were not able to. And it would have been viewed as VERY early, having to make the mediums last longer than they had in the first stint (albeit with lower fuel loads). If not for the superior straight line speed of the RBs I don't know that Max would have gotten past Lewis with tires that were fresher than what Lewis would have had. Again, strategies work relative to what others are doing. Where you are on the leaderboard and track at the time you implement them. It worked for RB, barely, and a one-stop for RB probably would have worked as well. Honestly we all know Bottas never was going to win so they probably should have done the Perez strategy once Bottas was on hards and behind Lewis; have him slow down and save his tires. No one other than Perez was ever going to threaten him. Do you think Lewis would have passed Max on hards if both RB cars did one-stoppers? What you are writing is not connected to reality, entirely speculation and a complete waste of time. A one stop strategy the way Perez did it was never going to win the race. The best it would get someone was third.
Bottas was correct, he wasn't whining. A two stop strategy by one of the Mercedes cars very well could have won one of them the race. Mercedes screwed the pooch and if they had listened to Bottas he or Hamilton could have won the race. The end. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2021 13:23:54 GMT -8
Boy Carlo, it's a good thing you are a mod here. Otherwise you would get your ass parked for a week for disrespecting the other members.  |
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Post by boomer on Jun 20, 2021 13:24:04 GMT -8
Mercedes screwed the pooch  |
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Post by boomer on Jun 20, 2021 13:28:14 GMT -8
It's a good thing I had my windows closed when Max passed Lulu for the win because my scream of delight was immense!  My hatred for Toto and Merc easily exceeds my dislike of Horner and RB |
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Post by olderguysrule on Jun 20, 2021 13:54:11 GMT -8
I wish I could speak or at least understand spanish, I'd be watching the spanish feed. :-)
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Korean cable TV is lousy. no more NASCAR nor NHRA
Jul 12, 2024 22:05:14 GMT -8
Korean cable TV is lousy. no more NASCAR nor NHRA
Jul 12, 2024 22:05:14 GMT -8