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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Sept 9, 2020 17:59:19 GMT -8
So they are keeping Lance Stroll over Perez? SMH!! Taking Vettel over Perez seems pretty stupid, imho. It is the exact opposite of stupid. Lawrence has big plans for Aston Martin F1. Having a 4 time WDC driving one their cars is a huge step up the prestige/serious ladder. Despite what you think Vettel will get Aston noticed. The stupid thing from a business perspective is keep Lance and letting the clear better racer Perez go. But Lance is his son so there you have it. |
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Post by hairyscotsman on Sept 9, 2020 18:13:07 GMT -8
Taking Vettel over Perez seems pretty stupid, imho. It is the exact opposite of stupid. Lawrence has big plans for Aston Martin F1. Having a 4 time WDC driving one their cars is a huge step up the prestige/serious ladder. Despite what you think Vettel will get Aston noticed. The stupid thing from a business perspective is keep Lance and letting the clear better racer Perez go. But Lance is his son so there you have it. Yeah I get that. I meant from a driving standpoint... |
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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Sept 9, 2020 18:19:33 GMT -8
It is the exact opposite of stupid. Lawrence has big plans for Aston Martin F1. Having a 4 time WDC driving one their cars is a huge step up the prestige/serious ladder. Despite what you think Vettel will get Aston noticed. The stupid thing from a business perspective is keep Lance and letting the clear better racer Perez go. But Lance is his son so there you have it. Yeah I get that. I meant from a driving standpoint... You really think Perez is a better racer than Vettel? You must be kidding. |
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Post by Pistola on Sept 9, 2020 18:29:57 GMT -8
there's only one thing for certain. the title of this thread. 2021, the wimpiest of silly seasons hasn't been wimpy. :-) It's been wimpy ever since Mercedes failed to make a Verstappen/Hamilton pairing. The rest of these drivers are just bit players. |
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Post by hairyscotsman on Sept 9, 2020 18:32:06 GMT -8
Yeah I get that. I meant from a driving standpoint... You really think Perez is a better racer than Vettel? You must be kidding. Now? Sure. |
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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Sept 9, 2020 18:34:15 GMT -8
You really think Perez is a better racer than Vettel? You must be kidding. Now? Sure. Are you under the influence? You really think a billionaire is going to hire a racing driver that will produce worse results than a driver they currently have? Really? |
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Post by hairyscotsman on Sept 9, 2020 18:39:19 GMT -8
Are you under the influence? You really think a billionaire is going to hire a racing driver that will produce worse results than a driver they currently have? Really? Billionaires do stupid things from time to time, esp in F1. I don't see what's so controversial about this opinion. I'm certainly not the only one out there saying it. I mean, just look at the shitshow Vettel has been for the last few years. It's not like he's set the world on fire or even been good. You disagree. That's cool. Doesn't mean I have to be drunk to think what I think. And besides, you just said it's about getting noticed. So if that's what it's about, maybe it works well for the team. If it's just about the driving, I don't see how it makes much sense to give up a very good midfield driver and all of the money he brings for Vettel. |
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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Sept 9, 2020 18:59:20 GMT -8
Are you under the influence? You really think a billionaire is going to hire a racing driver that will produce worse results than a driver they currently have? Really? Billionaires do stupid things from time to time, esp in F1. I don't see what's so controversial about this opinion. I'm certainly not the only one out there saying it. I mean, just look at the shitshow Vettel has been for the last few years. It's not like he's set the world on fire or even been good. You disagree. That's cool. Doesn't mean I have to be drunk to think what I think. And besides, you just said it's about getting noticed. So if that's what it's about, maybe it works well for the team. If it's just about the driving, I don;t see how giving up a very good midfield driver and all of the money he brings for Vettel. Who else is saying it? How many races has Perez won in the past 3 years? Zero. How many has Vettel won? 11. Vettel and Rosberg are the only two drivers in the past six years to seriously challenge Hamilton for the WDC. And Vettel was never in car that was day-in day-out as quick as Hamilton's. You think Vettel just got lucky with his results? One part this getting noticed the other part is bring in a proven 53 race winning driver who last year took pole in Canada and Japan and won the Singapore Grand Prix while his much favored teammate only took two wins. Yea, Vettel sucks. He isn't the shitshow, Ferrari's current state is. |
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Post by hairyscotsman on Sept 9, 2020 19:23:02 GMT -8
Billionaires do stupid things from time to time, esp in F1. I don't see what's so controversial about this opinion. I'm certainly not the only one out there saying it. I mean, just look at the shitshow Vettel has been for the last few years. It's not like he's set the world on fire or even been good. You disagree. That's cool. Doesn't mean I have to be drunk to think what I think. And besides, you just said it's about getting noticed. So if that's what it's about, maybe it works well for the team. If it's just about the driving, I don;t see how giving up a very good midfield driver and all of the money he brings for Vettel. Who else is saying it? How many races has Perez won in the past 3 years? Zero. How many has Vettel won? 11. Vettel and Rosberg are the only two drivers in the past six years to seriously challenge Hamilton for the WDC. And Vettel was never in car that was day-in day-out as quick as Hamilton's. You think Vettel just got lucky with his results? One part this getting noticed the other part is bring in a proven 53 race winning driver who last year took pole in Canada and Japan and won the Singapore Grand Prix while his much favored teammate only took two wins. Yea, Vettel sucks. He isn't the shitshow, Ferrari's current state is. Who else? Lots of people over on Autosport, and elsewehere, and I just saw this article linked on reddit: Perez is right to feel ‘hurt’ – he doesn’t deserve this the-race.com/formula-1/perez-is-right-to-feel-hurt-he-doesnt-deserve-this/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=website&utm_campaign=SocialSnapRaces won? Surely this isn't a serious argument. Vettel has had a race-winning car every year until this year, including a few years in dominant cars. Sergio has never had a race-winning car. Just because Ferrari is a shitshow now too, it doesn't mean Vettel isn't as well. The two are not mutually exclusive. When Ferrari have been quick the last few years, it's been Vettel's mistakes on the track that have been hurting them, not the engine. |
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Post by kingfisher on Sept 9, 2020 22:10:20 GMT -8
there's only one thing for certain. the title of this thread. 2021, the wimpiest of silly seasons hasn't been wimpy. :-) It's been wimpy ever since Mercedes failed to make a Verstappen/Hamilton pairing. The rest of these drivers are just bit players. I believe that Lewis probably threw a hissy-fit over any suggestion of bringing Verstappen in as his teammate. Max truly is Lewis' kryptonite. He's young and ascendant, where Lewis recognizes he doesn't stand a good chance of defeating him over a season with equal equipment. Max would be like Rosberg on steroids. He's now seasoned into a much more mature calculating and experienced driver. I believe as I stated a while back that Lewis would really prefer Vettel. Their lengthy history is so intertwined and with Lewis having the superior car and team in recent years, only truly threatened until Seb's title run self-destructed starting at Hockenheim and sliding ever since, just plays to the psychological edge Hambone loves to exploit. To beat Vettel in the same car would drive the proverbial stake through Vettel's heart before they both hang up their helmets. Vettel however, is still capable of pulling on Lewis what Rosberg did, and possesses the drive and determination to realize it. I'm sure that I'm not the only one who would love to see it. |
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Post by olderguysrule on Sept 10, 2020 1:24:02 GMT -8
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Post by mikey on Sept 10, 2020 3:56:24 GMT -8
Yeah I get that. I meant from a driving standpoint... You really think Perez is a better racer than Vettel? You must be kidding. I meant he's better than Stroll, WHY replace Perez and not Stroll? I get that he's daddys boy but good grief money and prestige has to me something doesn't it? If he keeps his son JUST be cause he's his son then he will never be a great Team!! Sure Lance has gotten better but take away the Mercedes engine and Lance is a low mid pack or lower driver while Perez is a much better driver. |
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Post by pushtopass on Sept 10, 2020 4:29:07 GMT -8
You really think Perez is a better racer than Vettel? You must be kidding. I meant he's better than Stroll, WHY replace Perez and not Stroll? I get that he's daddys boy but good grief money and prestige has to me something doesn't it? If he keeps his son JUST be cause he's his son then he will never be a great Team!! Sure Lance has gotten better but take away the Mercedes engine and Lance is a low mid pack or lower driver while Perez is a much better driver. If you look at results this year, taking into account that Perez was out for two races, Stroll is doing as well as or better than Perez. Even last year while Perez was clearly better at qualifying, Stroll made up ground during the race. I'm not saying Stroll is better, but toss in that he is the bosses son and close to on par with Perez, it's a no-brainer decision. |
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Post by chernaudi on Sept 10, 2020 4:37:57 GMT -8
And you have to remember that Perez's sponsorship backing saved the team when Veejay was dicking around and running it into the ground. Something that Larry Stroll fixed when he bought the team from the creditors. You also have to remember that he forced Andy Palmer to resign from AM after he was held responsible for AM's recent financial issues, which Stroll has also gone a long way to fixing.
And, even though Lance's father owns the team and is very likely (if not very obviously) a big part of his employment, so far this year he's done just as well if not better than Sergio, even allowing for Perez's DNS in two races due to Covid-19.
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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Sept 10, 2020 4:39:18 GMT -8
I meant he's better than Stroll, WHY replace Perez and not Stroll? I get that he's daddys boy but good grief money and prestige has to me something doesn't it? If he keeps his son JUST be cause he's his son then he will never be a great Team!! Sure Lance has gotten better but take away the Mercedes engine and Lance is a low mid pack or lower driver while Perez is a much better driver. If you look at results this year, taking into account that Perez was out for two races, Stroll is doing as well as or better than Perez. Even last year while Perez was clearly better at qualifying, Stroll made up ground during the race. I'm not saying Stroll is better, but toss in that he is the bosses son and close to on par with Perez, it's a no-brainer decision. Yes, it is a no brainer. |
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Post by Carlo_Carrera on Sept 10, 2020 4:45:15 GMT -8
Who else is saying it? How many races has Perez won in the past 3 years? Zero. How many has Vettel won? 11. Vettel and Rosberg are the only two drivers in the past six years to seriously challenge Hamilton for the WDC. And Vettel was never in car that was day-in day-out as quick as Hamilton's. You think Vettel just got lucky with his results? One part this getting noticed the other part is bring in a proven 53 race winning driver who last year took pole in Canada and Japan and won the Singapore Grand Prix while his much favored teammate only took two wins. Yea, Vettel sucks. He isn't the shitshow, Ferrari's current state is. Who else? Lots of people over on Autosport, and elsewehere, and I just saw this article linked on reddit: Perez is right to feel ‘hurt’ – he doesn’t deserve this the-race.com/formula-1/perez-is-right-to-feel-hurt-he-doesnt-deserve-this/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=website&utm_campaign=SocialSnapRaces won? Surely this isn't a serious argument. Vettel has had a race-winning car every year until this year, including a few years in dominant cars. Sergio has never had a race-winning car. Just because Ferrari is a shitshow now too, it doesn't mean Vettel isn't as well. The two are not mutually exclusive. When Ferrari have been quick the last few years, it's been Vettel's mistakes on the track that have been hurting them, not the engine. People on the Autosport forums? I am asking about folks within F1's or maybe some reputable journalists. And don't get me wrong, as I wrote earlier I think Aston should have dumped Lance to make room for Vettel pairing him with Perez. But we know why that didn't happen. By any metric you want to choose Vettel has proven to be the better racer. And really there is no need to argue this now because reports are saying Vettel has signed with Aston so we will see the results next year with Lance Stroll being the benchmark. |
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BigDad
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Post by BigDad on Sept 10, 2020 5:10:28 GMT -8
Vettel is damaged goods these days. I don't see him turning that around, especially in a 2nd-level team.
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Post by pushtopass on Sept 10, 2020 5:39:39 GMT -8
I know it's popular to bash Lewis as a prima donna who is flattered by his cars, but it is worth noting that he has spent his entire career with two teams. Meanwhile people like Vettel and Alonso keep moving. Clearly Lewis' talent outweighs any grief he causes a team (or perhaps he is not truly the prima donna so many claim). There is something to be said for that.
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jmjgt
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Post by jmjgt on Sept 10, 2020 6:31:03 GMT -8
I know it's popular to bash Lewis as a prima donna who is flattered by his cars, but it is worth noting that he has spent his entire career with two teams. Meanwhile people like Vettel and Alonso keep moving. Clearly Lewis' talent outweighs any grief he causes a team (or perhaps he is not truly the prima donna so many claim). There is something to be said for that. That's because Hamilton skipped the whole the whole Jr driver starting on a small team thing, he entered the sport in a team most others would have have to climb to. BTW, Rosberg only drove for two teams as well, as has Grosjean. |
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Post by montybriscoe on Sept 10, 2020 6:40:02 GMT -8
I know it's popular to bash Lewis as a prima donna who is flattered by his cars, but it is worth noting that he has spent his entire career with two teams. Meanwhile people like Vettel and Alonso keep moving. Clearly Lewis' talent outweighs any grief he causes a team (or perhaps he is not truly the prima donna so many claim). There is something to be said for that. Prost drove for four teams, including two stints with McLaren, from 1980 to 1993. Vettel will be joining his fourth team, excluding his one-off with BMW Sauber at Indy in 2007. Niki Lauda drove for five teams. Michael Schumacher drove for three teams excluding his one-off with Jordan. Senna drove for four teams. Nelson Piquet drove for four teams. Lewis is the rare exception, not the norm. Most top drivers do not spend their entire careers with two teams. That doesn't mean Lewis is all that more exceptional. He just happened to land in the right teams, at the right time. F1 careers are defined, partly, by timing and luck. |
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Korean cable TV is lousy. no more NASCAR nor NHRA
Jul 12, 2024 22:05:14 GMT -8
Korean cable TV is lousy. no more NASCAR nor NHRA
Jul 12, 2024 22:05:14 GMT -8